Sat, 26 May 2012
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Are the Dutch really flexible and direct? We take a look at the Dutch attitude to work, family life and time.The Netherlands is a small country with a limited internal market, consequently the Dutch look across their borders for markets. They started out as worldwide maritime traders in the 16th century and today they are still significant players in the global economy.
"The Netherlands" means "Low Lands"; a large part of the country is situated below sea level. The Netherlands is often referred to as Holland, but Holland is actually only the northwestern part of the country.
Society
With its 16 million inhabitants--16 728 091 (January 2012)--the Netherlands is the fourth most densely populated country in the world. Everyday life is structured down to the smallest detail. Private life and work are carefully planned and nothing is left to the unexpected. Ad hoc changes are not appreciated.
The Netherlands is a democracy with a tolerant, open society. Although 70 percent of the Dutch do not attend church anymore, Calvinism still strongly influences their values and beliefs. This Protestant Christian religion, introduced in the 16th century, dictates individual responsibility for moral salvage from the sinful world through introspection, total honesty, soberness, rejection of pleasure and the enjoyment of wealth.
Therefore, extremes are absent in society: political extremes, extreme emotions, extreme richness or extravagant lifestyles. Some money may be spent for pleasure, but frequent vacations abroad, comfortable houses and safe cars are preferred above luxury items.
The Dutch are mistakenly called stingy. But in reality they simply hate to waste everything from food to money. Maybe it is this virtue that made this small country an economic world power.
Egalitarian society
The Netherlands has an egalitarian society. Status and respect are obtained through study and work and not through family ties or old age. Every person is equal and should be treated accordingly, which may be difficult for foreigners to understand.
As a Brazilian general manager living in the Netherlands remarked, "I am happy that my Dutch personnel did not throw me out of my office the first week I worked in Amsterdam. As top manager in Rio, I barely spoke to my lower personnel. I was used to giving orders and being served.
"In Amsterdam I learned to exchange some words daily with the cleaning lady, to discuss all the work with my managers and to kindly ask my secretary what phone calls came in for me. I am now used to making my own photocopies and coffee. Once you know the rules here it is very pleasant and productive to work in such an open society".
A visiting Japanese CEO asked, "If the CEO is pouring his own coffee, what kind of power can he hold in the company?"
Many Americans think the Dutch way of working is time-consuming as no one can be given a quick order without explaining why.
In order to deliver good work, the Dutch like to consider the risks and consequences of everything they do, well in advance. They want to have detailed information. In the case something does go wrong, the Dutch individual will take full responsibility for the consequences. In the case of success, of course, they will take the full credit.
Who the client is
The Dutch work hard in their 36- to 40-hour week. Work is streamlined to make the client's life easy but at a steep price because foreigners often have the impression that Dutch people are not very service-minded.
This may seem so because in most countries, the client has a preferential position above the sales person and therefore in that particular situation, a higher status. In the Netherlands, however, goods and services are exchanged on an equal basis. Sales persons feel free to openly disagree and criticise their clients.
Consensus
The Dutch are famous in the Western world for the many hours a week they spend in meetings. Decision-making processes are complex.
Everyone involved needs to be heard. In the end a compromise will be reached in which every one agrees. Once agreed upon the work can progress steadily. Therefore, changes are usually lengthy processes.
The global traveler
The contrary takes place when Dutch businessmen and women travel. They usually have the individual authority to close deals on the spot without consulting the home office.
Dutch global traders are much more flexible abroad than at their home office.
Directness
The Dutch directness in the communication with foreigners regularly causes misunderstandings. Unable to make things understood through context and unable to read context, the Dutch express themselves verbally.
They speak in a friendly tone in rather short, clear, sober sentences lacking any form of politeness or courtesy.
The Dutch are distrustful of very polite conversations, afraid that an unpleasant message may be hidden which they are unable to detect.
Being very nice may awaken the suspicion that one is in need of a special favor. Politeness may also cause irritation as it is considered a waste of time.
Loss of face
The Dutch expect others to be open and direct like them. They will tell you what they think of you and criticise your work indifferent of your status if you are a superior or a subordinate.
They expect you to criticise their work in return, honestly and directly. If you detect mistakes in their work and you do not inform them about these mistakes, they will be extremely disappointed with you.
The Dutch do not feel ashamed when you inform them of a mistake. On the contrary, they feel that you give them the opportunity to correct and thus improve themselves. The Dutch feel that in the end, one learns from his mistakes.
Loss of face is a rather unknown concept in Dutch society when compared to other cultures.
Time off
The Dutch love time off to spend with their partner, kids and friends, for vacation or to study. Therefore they will prefer to reduce working hours instead of having an increase in salary.
Vacation days, depending on the labour contract, run from 21 to as many as 35 working days a year.
Expatriates on foreign work-contracts in the Netherlands often complain they are always in the office while the Dutch are on vacation.
Working hours may run from 9am to 5pm. Those who are unable to handle their job within the office hours may not be fit for the job.
As work is very well structured within organisations, much work is done during regular working hours. Except for those at management level, employees are reluctant to work overtime.
Concept of time
Being very organised and time conscious, one has to plan business appointments at least four weeks ahead, with bosses, clients and colleagues.
As for your private agenda you may be expected to plan an evening at the cinema with your best friend six weeks from today.
Of course there is no such thing as just "dropping by to say hello".
The family
Despite having a very open and individualistic society, when it comes to the family nucleus, it is a hermetically closed circle. The family nucleus is detached from the extended family.
Adult brothers and sisters usually see each other only on birthday celebrations, weddings and funerals. There is no moral obligation to take care of extended family members or elderly parents.
Contradictions
With all this planning and structuring, little is left to the unexpected. Therefore Dutch people do not excel in improvising. However, they have an adventurous mind and dare to take risks in business, which requests flexibility.
Despite the strong Calvinist background and a disapproval of extremes, homosexual marriages, sex on TV and legalised soft drugs are part of daily life.
The Dutch may have great work relationships with their colleagues, but they rarely invite them to their homes. Work and private life are strictly separated.
Also, Dutch businessmen do not feel obligated to entertain foreign business visitors after business hours.
Being an egalitarian society, personal and academic titles are not used on business cards. Only corporate Holland will print the academic titles of their managers on their business cards.
People retire between 50 and 65 years old. The elderly are not respected in the corporate world.
Elderly people may never be consulted for their wisdom but they are well taken care of in comfortable old-age houses once they are unable to live on their own. If you are wealthy or not, everyone gets equal treatment.
The Dutch are open and will enjoy lengthy discussions over a beer in a bar with mostly anybody. This relationship ends when you say goodbye at the door.
However, once you do have a Dutchman (or woman) as a friend, you have a friend for life.
Eleonor Breukel/ Expatica
I really do not recognize the dutch culture in this article at all. Basically, the article displays the dutch as being impolite, rude, inflexible and not very friendly. Though some of those descriptions might fit, most of them do not. This article gives the dutch culture less credit than it should.
Martijn, that is precisely the thing about culture. Can I assume that you are Dutch? By your name? A fish cannot tell that it is living in water; such is the nature of culture. So of course you will not agree with most of this article.
I agree with Sacha response to martijn's comment. As outsiders living here, in particular of different complexion, one can't hardly argue that one is not felt welcomed here. The article certainly tries to sugar coat many things...I suppose if I Dutchperson were to go to any country they would feel welcomed, and when they are back here they are still felt welcomed...they never truly are treated as an outsider is treated here...
I visited Holland last March and had a wonderful time. Everyong treated nicely and I had no problems. The Dutch are people like people all over the world. If you're nice to them they will be nice to you.
Yes, they were nice because you are a tourist and then you go back home.
for a short period (i.e. if you're a tourist) you won't really notice it. but if you live here for a longer time, then things start to get complicated and difficult.
As an expat adult here i find it difficult to make new friends here with the dutch. Tried so many forums because face-to-face communication is impossible for me. Didn't work either.
for a short period (i.e. if you're a tourist) you won't really notice it. but if you live here for a longer time, then things start to get complicated and difficult.
As an expat adult here i find it difficult to make new friends here with the dutch. Tried so many forums because face-to-face communication is impossible for me. Didn't work either.
As a dutchman myself, I think the article is a pretty good reflection of the country i was born in, live in, and love.
Dutch are still people with different educational level and exposure, so i can understand several elements discussed in the article; Nevertheless, One thing that really disappointed me is the discussion about the client .. the author sugarcoated the terribly bad customer service in the country by implying the right to disagree and critisize.. however, that is not the case.. customer service agents have the right to disagree or critisize only after being willing to help the customer.. this intention is widely unavailable and simply a lot of agents don't care because they know how safe are their jobs and how protected they are by the country's work law ..that is something that even the majority of the dutch i met admit and it is a shame that the author is trying to hide it.
Definitely agree with the part about wanting time off! Social life is very important here.<br /> Mandy Taylor -
I don't know if I can say -10 as mild winter.
As a Dutchie, this is the first somewhat accurate article I've read on this website. However, the statements about politeness might be true, I think the fact that this refers to the 'American politeness' should be added. The Dutch will never ask you how you are doing if they weren't genuinely interested. This has to do with keeping things open and honest I think. We are very keen on that. Now it sort of seems that we're rude and impolite, to you. That's the funny thing about culture; it's all in perception.
I'm (also) Dutch, and I think especially the part about everyone being treated as equal is true. I once did an exchange (with school) with a school in Germany, we talked about our teachers and they thought 'our' way of communicating with our teachers was more like friends, instead of teacher and student. They would be a lot more polite, while we wouldn't only talk about school but also about other things. Not like one's a higher status, but equal to one each other.
In that confidence.
A red rose
near a prominent
stable, a white
dream where
the sound
of that candle
appears in
the sky.
Francesco Sinibaldi
I have been living in the Netherlands more than 20 years and I speak Dutch fluently but it is still difficult to make a good -friends with the Dutch.
All my friends are non-Dutch , so I can fully understand to the expat who just arrive or live for a couple months or longer.
In my opinion, this description did the Dutchies a great favor, if i were to write about the dutch people. trust me, with my experience so far, it wont be as gacious as this article. Therefore, i can only say to Dutchies, who feel offended by the article, be happy. But i do greatly disagree with the last line, I quote: {However, once you do have a Dutchman (or woman) as a friend, you have a friend for life }. This is far from the truth,
if you are "Buitenlander" as most foreigners are generally referred to, you can just forget about it, pls dont be decieved by that friendly smile or coffee being offered here and there, even with the pleasantry,you always have to watch your back. 2ce being smiled at, means end of discussion, 2ce coffee offered, means u have to take ur leave "You never find a true friend in the Netherlands", i am not even sure, if they truly understand what the word or the value, "friend" means. The word friend, is seriously far fetch. So if u're here thinking, u'll find a friend, well,keep dreaming bcos u're in for a very, very long wait. And if u're a tourist, try calling ,when u're visiting again, u dont seem to be included in their agenda, meaning, u will have to give a short biography of yourself
In my opinion, this description did the Dutchies a great favor, if i were to write about the dutch people. trust me, with my experience so far, it wont be as gacious as this article. Therefore, i can only say to Dutchies, who feel offended by the article, be happy. But i do greatly disagree with the last line, I quote: {However, once you do have a Dutchman (or woman) as a friend, you have a friend for life }. This is far from the truth,
if you are "Buitenlander" as most foreigners are generally referred to, you can just forget about it, pls dont be decieved by that friendly smile or coffee being offered here and there, even with the pleasantry,you always have to watch your back. 2ce being smiled at, means end of discussion, 2ce coffee offered, means u have to take ur leave "You never find a true friend in the Netherlands", i am not even sure, if they truly understand what the word or the value, "friend" means. The word friend, is seriously far fetch. So if u're here thinking, u'll find a friend, well,keep dreaming bcos u're in for a very, very long wait. And if u're a tourist, try calling ,when u're visiting again, u dont seem to be included in their agenda, meaning, u will have to give a short biography of yourself
This seems to be a Dutch view on how others sees the Dutch. I was quite surprised with the claim that Holland is not a country of extremes, when the far right have 20% of the vote and the racist Wilders is calling the shots in government. Scratch below the surface and you can see a lot of intolerance here
I have lived in a few European countries and the same happens everywhere. In the South people appear to be very friendly and smily at first but when you want to go beyond the surface there's nothing there. In the North, my friends tend to be either expats or not from the city I have worked in, because obviously the locals have their good old friends and do not necessarily need to make new friends on a deep level... Everywhere, the American way of life has professionalized our way of dealing with others to the point where one can hardly spot honesty and sincerity behind their professional smile. We are the robots :-D
@R Carter, please don't make up facts. Wilders never got 20% of the votes. The highest percentage he got was 17% at the European elections in 2009. In 2010 he got 15,5% of the votes at the elections for parliament. In 2011 it was 12% at the provincial elections.
And if you followed the news, you would know that Wilders doesn't decide anything anymore.
@pepec, for how long will wilders keep up d low vote precisely? the problem is voting goes along with the Dutch emotions, when they are pissed with the economy, they blame the buitenlander, therefore vote wilders, when they are abit adjusted to the economy, oh horrible wilders. Thats precisely the point. I know, atleast from my experience that the Dutch gets an Oscar award in going behind one's back, they are never direct as they claim, but rude, and in my opinion rude differs from being direct. When you talk with most Dutch people, they dont like wilders, yet they vote for him, they dont want the Euro, yet they accepted the euro, and then, they complain. "When have you ever seen the Dutch on news or on the street matching for what is right or for equality and justice? Almost never.
@ Ron seal, sure i agree with you, finding a friend or having a friend is the same everywhere else in the world, but Holland is far extremely individualistic culture, everyman for himself, in my opinion, they are just so selfish, then u get this stupid excuse about the weather, its cold in iceland as well, and the people cannot in anyway be compared to the complaining,unfriendily Dutchies.
Chances of finding that word friend or the least bit honest is like 1% while in most countries you get atleast 40% chances.
Well, if u can't beat them, u join them.....which is also not advisable, because when you start acting like the Dutchies do, then you become (onbetrouwbaar, niet eerlyk) meaning unreliable and not honest.
@lautje For the record, i am Dutch, atleast technically since i have one dutch parent. But i do know, how growing up was becos one of my parents isn't Dutch, everything you do is wrong, you are consider stupid at first glance. Additionally, I know, how my mother was treated during divorce with my dad, so please save me that speech of Dutch equality, when its all on face value. .
Trying being a mixed child or a foreigner, then you will find the true color of the Dutch people. As they say, a fish never recognised its own inhabitant.
@ruth, No Ruth, they (the Dutch) don't vote for Wilders. Like I said, Wilders never got more then 17% of the votes. And that was in 2009. His support is considerably lower at the moment. Those figures are facts. So more then 80% of the Dutch never voted for Wilders. You can predict all you want, but until it actually happens those predictions only exist in your head.
And maybe you should follow foreign news a bit more. Blaming foreigners is not exactly exclusive to the Netherlands at the moment. It happens all over Europe. Only a few weeks ago Marine Le Pen got 18% of the French votes. For exactly the same reasons as some Dutch vote for Wilders: economy, unemployment, the Euro, etc. The same goes for all other European countries.
I really do not recognize the dutch culture in this article at all. Basically, the article displays the dutch as being impolite, rude, inflexible and not very friendly. Though some of those descriptions might fit, most of them do not. This article gives the dutch culture less credit than it should.
Martijn, that is precisely the thing about culture. Can I assume that you are Dutch? By your name? A fish cannot tell that it is living in water; such is the nature of culture. So of course you will not agree with most of this article.
I agree with Sacha response to martijn's comment. As outsiders living here, in particular of different complexion, one can't hardly argue that one is not felt welcomed here. The article certainly tries to sugar coat many things...I suppose if I Dutchperson were to go to any country they would feel welcomed, and when they are back here they are still felt welcomed...they never truly are treated as an outsider is treated here...
I visited Holland last March and had a wonderful time. Everyong treated nicely and I had no problems. The Dutch are people like people all over the world. If you're nice to them they will be nice to you.
Yes, they were nice because you are a tourist and then you go back home.
for a short period (i.e. if you're a tourist) you won't really notice it. but if you live here for a longer time, then things start to get complicated and difficult.
As an expat adult here i find it difficult to make new friends here with the dutch. Tried so many forums because face-to-face communication is impossible for me. Didn't work either.
for a short period (i.e. if you're a tourist) you won't really notice it. but if you live here for a longer time, then things start to get complicated and difficult.
As an expat adult here i find it difficult to make new friends here with the dutch. Tried so many forums because face-to-face communication is impossible for me. Didn't work either.
As a dutchman myself, I think the article is a pretty good reflection of the country i was born in, live in, and love.
Dutch are still people with different educational level and exposure, so i can understand several elements discussed in the article; Nevertheless, One thing that really disappointed me is the discussion about the client .. the author sugarcoated the terribly bad customer service in the country by implying the right to disagree and critisize.. however, that is not the case.. customer service agents have the right to disagree or critisize only after being willing to help the customer.. this intention is widely unavailable and simply a lot of agents don't care because they know how safe are their jobs and how protected they are by the country's work law ..that is something that even the majority of the dutch i met admit and it is a shame that the author is trying to hide it.
Definitely agree with the part about wanting time off! Social life is very important here.<br /> Mandy Taylor -
I don't know if I can say -10 as mild winter.
As a Dutchie, this is the first somewhat accurate article I've read on this website. However, the statements about politeness might be true, I think the fact that this refers to the 'American politeness' should be added. The Dutch will never ask you how you are doing if they weren't genuinely interested. This has to do with keeping things open and honest I think. We are very keen on that. Now it sort of seems that we're rude and impolite, to you. That's the funny thing about culture; it's all in perception.
I'm (also) Dutch, and I think especially the part about everyone being treated as equal is true. I once did an exchange (with school) with a school in Germany, we talked about our teachers and they thought 'our' way of communicating with our teachers was more like friends, instead of teacher and student. They would be a lot more polite, while we wouldn't only talk about school but also about other things. Not like one's a higher status, but equal to one each other.
In that confidence.
A red rose
near a prominent
stable, a white
dream where
the sound
of that candle
appears in
the sky.
Francesco Sinibaldi
I have been living in the Netherlands more than 20 years and I speak Dutch fluently but it is still difficult to make a good -friends with the Dutch.
All my friends are non-Dutch , so I can fully understand to the expat who just arrive or live for a couple months or longer.
In my opinion, this description did the Dutchies a great favor, if i were to write about the dutch people. trust me, with my experience so far, it wont be as gacious as this article. Therefore, i can only say to Dutchies, who feel offended by the article, be happy. But i do greatly disagree with the last line, I quote: {However, once you do have a Dutchman (or woman) as a friend, you have a friend for life }. This is far from the truth,
if you are "Buitenlander" as most foreigners are generally referred to, you can just forget about it, pls dont be decieved by that friendly smile or coffee being offered here and there, even with the pleasantry,you always have to watch your back. 2ce being smiled at, means end of discussion, 2ce coffee offered, means u have to take ur leave "You never find a true friend in the Netherlands", i am not even sure, if they truly understand what the word or the value, "friend" means. The word friend, is seriously far fetch. So if u're here thinking, u'll find a friend, well,keep dreaming bcos u're in for a very, very long wait. And if u're a tourist, try calling ,when u're visiting again, u dont seem to be included in their agenda, meaning, u will have to give a short biography of yourself
In my opinion, this description did the Dutchies a great favor, if i were to write about the dutch people. trust me, with my experience so far, it wont be as gacious as this article. Therefore, i can only say to Dutchies, who feel offended by the article, be happy. But i do greatly disagree with the last line, I quote: {However, once you do have a Dutchman (or woman) as a friend, you have a friend for life }. This is far from the truth,
if you are "Buitenlander" as most foreigners are generally referred to, you can just forget about it, pls dont be decieved by that friendly smile or coffee being offered here and there, even with the pleasantry,you always have to watch your back. 2ce being smiled at, means end of discussion, 2ce coffee offered, means u have to take ur leave "You never find a true friend in the Netherlands", i am not even sure, if they truly understand what the word or the value, "friend" means. The word friend, is seriously far fetch. So if u're here thinking, u'll find a friend, well,keep dreaming bcos u're in for a very, very long wait. And if u're a tourist, try calling ,when u're visiting again, u dont seem to be included in their agenda, meaning, u will have to give a short biography of yourself
This seems to be a Dutch view on how others sees the Dutch. I was quite surprised with the claim that Holland is not a country of extremes, when the far right have 20% of the vote and the racist Wilders is calling the shots in government. Scratch below the surface and you can see a lot of intolerance here
I have lived in a few European countries and the same happens everywhere. In the South people appear to be very friendly and smily at first but when you want to go beyond the surface there's nothing there. In the North, my friends tend to be either expats or not from the city I have worked in, because obviously the locals have their good old friends and do not necessarily need to make new friends on a deep level... Everywhere, the American way of life has professionalized our way of dealing with others to the point where one can hardly spot honesty and sincerity behind their professional smile. We are the robots :-D
@R Carter, please don't make up facts. Wilders never got 20% of the votes. The highest percentage he got was 17% at the European elections in 2009. In 2010 he got 15,5% of the votes at the elections for parliament. In 2011 it was 12% at the provincial elections.
And if you followed the news, you would know that Wilders doesn't decide anything anymore.
@pepec, for how long will wilders keep up d low vote precisely? the problem is voting goes along with the Dutch emotions, when they are pissed with the economy, they blame the buitenlander, therefore vote wilders, when they are abit adjusted to the economy, oh horrible wilders. Thats precisely the point. I know, atleast from my experience that the Dutch gets an Oscar award in going behind one's back, they are never direct as they claim, but rude, and in my opinion rude differs from being direct. When you talk with most Dutch people, they dont like wilders, yet they vote for him, they dont want the Euro, yet they accepted the euro, and then, they complain. "When have you ever seen the Dutch on news or on the street matching for what is right or for equality and justice? Almost never.
@ Ron seal, sure i agree with you, finding a friend or having a friend is the same everywhere else in the world, but Holland is far extremely individualistic culture, everyman for himself, in my opinion, they are just so selfish, then u get this stupid excuse about the weather, its cold in iceland as well, and the people cannot in anyway be compared to the complaining,unfriendily Dutchies.
Chances of finding that word friend or the least bit honest is like 1% while in most countries you get atleast 40% chances.
Well, if u can't beat them, u join them.....which is also not advisable, because when you start acting like the Dutchies do, then you become (onbetrouwbaar, niet eerlyk) meaning unreliable and not honest.
@lautje For the record, i am Dutch, atleast technically since i have one dutch parent. But i do know, how growing up was becos one of my parents isn't Dutch, everything you do is wrong, you are consider stupid at first glance. Additionally, I know, how my mother was treated during divorce with my dad, so please save me that speech of Dutch equality, when its all on face value. .
Trying being a mixed child or a foreigner, then you will find the true color of the Dutch people. As they say, a fish never recognised its own inhabitant.
@ruth, No Ruth, they (the Dutch) don't vote for Wilders. Like I said, Wilders never got more then 17% of the votes. And that was in 2009. His support is considerably lower at the moment. Those figures are facts. So more then 80% of the Dutch never voted for Wilders. You can predict all you want, but until it actually happens those predictions only exist in your head.
And maybe you should follow foreign news a bit more. Blaming foreigners is not exactly exclusive to the Netherlands at the moment. It happens all over Europe. Only a few weeks ago Marine Le Pen got 18% of the French votes. For exactly the same reasons as some Dutch vote for Wilders: economy, unemployment, the Euro, etc. The same goes for all other European countries.
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